1 1 TOWN BOARD and PLANNING BOARD 2 TOWN OF BRUNSWICK, NEW YORK 3 -------------------------------------------------------- 4 CARRIAGE HILL ESTATES PLANNED DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT (PDD) 5 APPLICATION 6 -------------------------------------------------------- 7 STENOGRAPHIC MINUTES OF PUBLIC HEARING conducted in 8 the above-entitled matter on the 12th day of December, 2005, 9 at the Town of Brunswick Town Office, 336 Town Office Road, 10 Brunswick, New York, commencing at 6:30 p.m. 11 TOWN OF BRUNSWICK BOARD MEMBERS: 12 Supervisor PHILIP HERRINGTON 13 Councilwoman CAROLYN ABRAMS 14 Councilmen CARL CLEMENTE 15 PATRICK POLETO 16 SAM SALVI 17 Clerk SUSAN QUEST-SHERMAN 18 PLANNING BOARD MEMBERS: 19 Chair SHAWN MALONE 20 Members MICHAEL CZORNYJ 21 KEVIN MAINELLO 22 RUSSELL OSTER 23 DAVID TARBOX 24 JOSEPH WETMILLER 2 1 APPEARANCES: 2 ANDREW W. GILCHRIST, ESQ. - Town Board Legal Advisor 3 MARK KESTNER - Kestner Engineering 4 MICHAEL UCCELLINI - President, United Development Group 5 GREG URSBRUNG - Engineer, Saratoga Associates 6 RICK BENAS - Landscape Architect, Saratoga Associates 7 WENDY CIMINO - Engineer; Creighton Manning Engineering 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 3 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 (The Public Notice was read by the Town Clerk, 3 Susan Quest-Sherman.) 4 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: At this point, I'd like 5 to turn the meeting over to the attorney, Mr. 6 Gilchrist. Maybe Andy can explain the procedure 7 tonight to us, please. 8 MR. GILCHRIST: These mikes are wired in, as I 9 understand it, to our recording system. We waited a 10 moment, because we're having a stenographic 11 transcript made of the public hearing tonight as 12 well so that all comments can be accurately 13 recorded. 14 As Supervisor Herrington said, my name is 15 Andrew Gilchrist. I'm an attorney representing the 16 Town Board on the review of this Planned Development 17 District application as well as the other 18 applications pending before the Board. 19 Just to bring everyone in the room and in the 20 hallway back up-to-date on the procedure, as the 21 Town Clerk read into the record, this is an 22 application made by United Development Group for a 23 Planned Development District under the Zoning Code 24 of the Town of Brunswick. 4 1 This applicant has also submitted complete site 2 plan and subdivision applications to the Planning 3 Board, has performed all the engineering work 4 necessary to file complete applications in front of 5 the Planning Board; hence, this is a joint public 6 hearing of both the Town Board and the Planning 7 Board. 8 As I say, this application in particular has 9 not only the PDD application in front of the Town 10 Board but has filed complete applications for site 11 plan and subdivision with the Planning Board. 12 When the applications came in, as with the 13 others in town, a Full Environmental Impact 14 Statement was submitted. And as you know, there are 15 a number of public agencies that will address this 16 application. 17 When the Full Environmental Impact Statement 18 was submitted, this Board circulated that document 19 plus a copy of the application to all of the other 20 what are called involved agencies, all the other 21 public agencies that will ultimately need to review 22 this application and issue permits or approvals for 23 the project. 24 It was determined that this Board would serve 5 1 as SEQRA lead agency. And what that means is that 2 this Board controls the SEQRA process making sure 3 that all of the issues that have been addressed are 4 addressed completely and also making sure that those 5 issues that should be reviewed, including those 6 raised by the public, have been adequately reviewed 7 and included in the Impact Statement. 8 After this Board was declared lead agency, it 9 issued what's called a positive declaration 10 requiring the preparation of a Full Environmental 11 Impact Statement. 12 Once the positive declaration was issued, this 13 Board conducted scoping. And what that process was 14 designed to do is to identify those issues that 15 needed to be addressed in the Full Environmental 16 Impact Statement, which has been prepared by the 17 applicant. 18 A final scope for that Impact Statement was 19 arrived at and issued almost a year ago, last 20 December of 2004. Since that time, the applicant 21 has been working on analyzing those issues addressed 22 in the scope, making sure that those issues, 23 potential environmental impact issues, were reviewed 24 and discussed. 6 1 Those documents were then submitted to the Town 2 for what is called a completeness review: Has the 3 applicant fully addressed those issues so that the 4 public understands the project and has a meaningful 5 opportunity to submit comment? 6 That process took a few back and forths between 7 the applicant, the Town Board and its consultants to 8 make sure that the document was complete, meaning 9 that it's adequate for public review and inspection 10 and comment. 11 That document was accepted in November of this 12 year and this public hearing was noticed to be held. 13 This is a public hearing, I'd like the record to 14 note, pursuant to the Town Zoning Code for the 15 Planned Development District as well as the site 16 plan and subdivision applications which have been 17 filed with the Planning Board. And this does also 18 constitute the SEQRA public hearing to accept 19 comment on the information contained in the Draft 20 Environmental Impact Statement. 21 As the Town Clerk read for the record, and I'll 22 repeat, the notice was published in The Record. It 23 was posted at Town Hall. It's been on the Town web 24 site. Notice of the public hearing was also mailed 7 1 to all property owners within 500 feet of the 2 project site to the addresses on file at the Town 3 Hall. 4 Now, copies of the applications, including the 5 PDD, site plan and subdivision applications, have 6 been on file here at the Town Clerk's office for 7 public review and inspection. The DEIS has been on 8 file here for public review and inspection. A copy 9 of the DEIS was posted at the Brunswick Community 10 Library for the public to review as well. 11 I'll note for the record that the Town has made 12 an effort to make sure that these application 13 materials have been available and the public had the 14 opportunity to review them. Even during this period 15 of time of transitioning from the old Town Hall to 16 the new Town Hall, effort was made to have those 17 documents available. 18 The DEIS, in preparation for this meeting, has 19 also been sent to all of the other interested and 20 involved agencies to let them know of the hearing as 21 well as the content of the DEIS. For the record, 22 those agencies include all of the individual members 23 of the Town Board and the Planning Board, plus the 24 individual members of the Town Zoning Board of 8 1 Appeals. All the department heads in the Town have 2 received a complete copy of the DEIS. 3 The DEIS also went to all the pertinent county 4 agencies, including County Health Department, 5 Highway Department and Planning. Also, the County 6 Sewer Department, in conjunction with the City of 7 Troy, are aware of this project given the extension 8 of the water and sewer. 9 The DEIS went to New York State agencies 10 involved as well: Department of Transportation, 11 Department of Environmental Conservation, Department 12 of Health and the Department of Parks & Recreation 13 and Historic Preservation. 14 There are federal wetland issues on this 15 property. The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers was 16 provided a complete copy of the DEIS. 17 In addition, complete copies of the DEIS went 18 to all five fire districts in this area, 19 Mountainview, Brunswick One, Center Brunswick, Eagle 20 Mills and Speigletown. There are two school 21 districts relevant to this application. The school 22 district boundary line does bisect this property. 23 So complete copies of the DEIS went to Brittonkill 24 as well as Averill Park. And as we indicated, there 9 1 was a copy on file at the community library. 2 It's important to note that these DEIS's, even 3 though they're fairly voluminous, are sent to these 4 other agencies for their review and comment. This 5 is a coordinated environmental review of this 6 action. This Board serves as lead agency. In that 7 capacity, this Board does reach out to the other 8 involved agencies that will again need to comment 9 and either permit or approve a certain aspect of 10 this project to receive their comments as well. 11 This has to be an open process and this Board is 12 conducting itself that way in compliance with the 13 SEQRA regulations. 14 The purpose of the public hearing tonight is to 15 receive comments from the members of the public on 16 the application documents, plus the DEIS. Comments 17 relative to those applications and the DEIS are 18 welcome tonight. 19 The Town Board has not made any decision and we 20 have counseled the Town Board not to make any 21 decision on this application until this record has 22 been fully created, meaning the application 23 materials and the DEIS comments received from the 24 public which, under regulatory requirements, must be 10 1 fully addressed and answered by the applicant. And 2 once that information has been created and comments, 3 if any, have been received from the other public 4 involved and interested agencies, then this Board 5 needs to make the reasoned determination on that 6 record on whether to approve, approve with 7 conditions or disapprove the action. Until that 8 record is created, we've advised the Board not to 9 predetermine the action. 10 So tonight is important in that it's the 11 opportunity for the public to give this Board its 12 comments, including questions, on any issue that you 13 want to raise pertaining to the applications so that 14 the Board can consider that in making its final 15 determination. 16 As indicated, we do have a stenographer here. 17 There's a complete stenographic transcript being 18 made. These do become available after a period of 19 two to three weeks. That will also be a public 20 document and is available for public review and 21 inspection. 22 After the close of the public hearing, there is 23 also an additional period of time for written 24 comments to be submitted. So if tonight, for 11 1 whatever reason, you do not wish to place comments 2 on the record verbally, there will be a written 3 comment period whenever the public hearing is 4 closed. The written comment period follows that for 5 a certain period of time. That will be addressed in 6 more detail later in the evening. 7 The purpose of the public hearing is to receive 8 comment. It is not designed as a question and 9 answer session or a debate session. It is to allow 10 the Board to hear the comments of the public on the 11 application documents and the DEIS. If there is an 12 issue that's raised factually concerning any 13 information in those documents that can be addressed 14 by the applicant, they're free to do so, but be 15 advised again this is not a situation where there's 16 a question and answer. 17 The Board will be holding further meetings to 18 deliberate these comments later in the process, but 19 tonight's purpose is not to debate the project but 20 to receive your comments for consideration by the 21 applicant and the Board. 22 Procedurally, the applicant will present an 23 overview of its project so that everyone has an 24 opportunity to hear that presentation. There are 12 1 some consultants that the applicant has brought as 2 well. Once that presentation has ended, the 3 Supervisor and Chairman of the Planning Board will 4 conduct the public hearing to allow comments to be 5 received. You'll hear later in the evening that 6 when you make a comment, you'll need to come to the 7 podium so that it can be heard and taped on the 8 Town's system. Put your name and address on the 9 record. 10 And with that, I'll recognize the Supervisor 11 again. 12 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Thank you, Andy. Okay. 13 At this point, I'd like to turn the meeting over to 14 Michael Uccellini and/or his consultants to present 15 the project. 16 MR. UCCELLINI: Thank you, Phil, and thank you, 17 Andy. My name is Michael Uccellini. I'm president 18 of the United Development Group of Companies. The 19 United Development Group of Companies is a 20 full-service real estate development and property 21 management firm that's based in Rensselaer County. 22 It's been in business for over 30 years. Several 23 principals of the firm, including myself and my 24 family, live in the Town of Brunswick. 13 1 We have over 25 years experience in developing 2 and managing senior housing with over a thousand 3 units in our portfolio and ten different properties, 4 eight of those in the Capital Region alone. As a 5 company, and as an individual who resides in the 6 Town, we are dedicated to the Town's Comprehensive 7 Plan guidelines and principles. 8 Our vision for Carriage Hill was an 9 intergenerational community, a community that would 10 fill a need in the town. It would span several 11 generations that consisted of the Eisenhower Era 12 Generation, the Baby Boom Generation and Generation 13 X. It would be a community that would be active and 14 fun. And when we looked at this site, we reviewed 15 thoroughly the Town's Comprehensive Plan and we used 16 senior housing which was spelled out and called for 17 in the Town's Plan. 18 We clustered the carriage homes in the 19 development. We used planning techniques like 20 Planned Development Districts. We're very sensitive 21 to the growth that's occurring in the Town and we 22 feel that our building design and site design meets 23 with the Comprehensive Plan guidelines. 24 This project, Carriage Hill, will enhance the 14 1 quality of life for the seniors in the Town and 2 there are several Comprehensive Plan principles that 3 are addressed in the DEIS and the site design. And 4 those consist of the preservation of open space, the 5 creation of recreational areas, the protection of 6 environmentally sensitive resources, which you will 7 hear more about, and the extension of the public 8 infrastructure. 9 The site is a 217-acre site with rolling 10 topography that's bordered on the north by Route 2 11 and on the south by Pinewoods Avenue, to the west 12 by the Country Club of Troy, and to the east by 13 various open terrain and some residential areas. 14 There are two school districts that encompass the 15 property, the Brittonkill district and the Averill 16 Park district. And there's a National Grid property 17 that runs in a northern to southerly direction that 18 dissects the property as well. 19 The three housing components for Orchard 20 Village consist of the estate homes, 19 estate home 21 lots, 87 carriage homes in three different areas. 22 And those areas consist of, over here on the east 23 side, 56 homes in this area called Carriage Hill 24 Landing East, nine homes in this area called 15 1 Carriage Hill Landing South and 22 homes in this 2 area called Carriage Hill Landing West. 3 The estate homes are in the middle of the 4 property. And then we have 204 apartment units 5 called Orchard Village, which is independent living 6 for seniors, in the northern section of the property 7 on 44 acres. 8 We took great stride and approach in designing 9 the property such that we were able to cluster the 10 carriage homes. We were able to pull the housing 11 away from the surrounding area and work with the 12 topography and the design to just meet and keep the 13 scenic and naturalistic settings that exist on the 14 land today. 15 In addition, in terms of quality of life and 16 recreation, it was important for us to provide one 17 and a quarter miles of walking trails that will 18 connect all three different housing types, because 19 this is really an intergenerational community that 20 we want to come together as a community as a whole. 21 When we designed the property, we were 22 concerned about the Troy Country Club and its vistas 23 and we created over a 10-acre conservation zone down 24 here in the southwest portion of the site; that is, 16 1 to the east of the fifth hole of the Troy Country 2 Club. 3 We also have created three community garden 4 quad areas. As part of the DEIS, we analyzed the 5 site for wetlands and archeological. We actually 6 dug over 1,100 holes on this property during the 7 archeological investigation and found three historic 8 sites. 9 Two are known as the W.J. Stoning site and the 10 C. Colehammer site and the other one is unnamed. 11 Those were found in the lower portion of the 12 property; one here, one there and one up in this 13 area. And we are currently working with SHPO. 14 We have actually sent them our inclusions and 15 recommendations and will be preserving those 16 historic sites and providing protective buffers. 17 Any estate home that purchases land will have 18 archeological covenants and deeds that are 19 associated with that land and SHPO in accordance 20 with our inclusions. 21 Seventy-five acres of the land will remain 22 forever wild, will not be developed, will go 23 directly into the Homeowner's Association to be 24 maintained by the Homeowner's Association. And we 17 1 will have a 10,000 square foot clubhouse. That is 2 this building right here. Although it's a part of 3 the senior housing, it will be an amenity-filled 4 clubhouse that we'll talk extensively about later 5 that will cater to the entire community and be used 6 by the entire community. 7 The estate homes consist of 19 lots on 73 8 acres. They range in size from two to eight acres 9 with an average lot size of about four acres. This 10 housing product type will cater to the baby boom and 11 Gen X-ers. 12 There will be deed restrictions and covenants 13 as it relates to architectural details. United 14 Group will be the master developer over the estate 15 homes and will sell the lots to homeowners who will 16 have custom builders build the homes all in 17 accordance with the architectural guidelines that 18 will be in keeping with the rural character of the 19 Town of Brunswick. Home size will be about 4,500 20 square feet. 21 The Carriage Hill Landing community, as I said, 22 consists of 87 homes and three clusters. The lots 23 will range in size from a quarter to a half acre 24 with an average lot size of about a third of an 18 1 acre. These homes will be about 1,600 to 1,800 2 square feet on the first floor and if they have a 3 second story or half a story -- we've kind of shown 4 two different kinds of homes here -- they could grow 5 in size to 2,200 to 2,400 square feet. 6 This housing will cater to the baby boom 7 generation. We feel that the design of this housing 8 is in concert with the Comprehensive Plan guidelines 9 for cluster development, sensitive growth and 10 blending architectural design. 11 There will be several different floor plans 12 across the 87 homes with several different 13 elevations to break up the streetscape. There will 14 be extensive landscaping around the home and along 15 the street and, you know, most importantly, this 16 home will be maintenance-free living. There's a lot 17 of baby boomers that are looking to right-size at 18 this stage of their life. And the landscaping, snow 19 removal of the walkways, driveways will all be done 20 through the HOA. 21 The goal for the development at the end of the 22 day when we're done is to make it feel mature, make 23 it feel unique, make it feel like it's there and 24 that it blends in with the surrounding character. 19 1 And we're going to use the building design and the 2 topography and the landscape architecture to 3 accomplish that. 4 Orchard Village is our 204-unit independent 5 living senior community for the moderate income 6 senior. The Comprehensive Plan calls for the Town 7 to define areas to develop for moderate income 8 senior housing. There's nothing in the Town for the 9 moderate income senior. There's several properties 10 available that are affordable, income-restricted. 11 There's several properties that are available 12 at the very higher end not only in the town but in 13 the county or in the Capital Region, but nobody's 14 building to the middle income senior and that's what 15 this project will do. It will be an age-restricted 16 community of 62 and older. 17 We will be catering, as I said earlier, to the 18 Eisenhower and Depression Era generations. And it 19 will consist of nine buildings with 20 to 22 20 apartments per building, an amenity-filled 21 clubhouse, unique and spacious, one- and two-bedroom 22 floor plans. And United Group's proprietary SUN 23 program, which stands for Senior Umbrella 24 Network -- and I'll talk about that in more detail 20 1 later -- will be the liaison to a gateway of 2 services and activities that will allow the seniors 3 to relax and enjoy life. 4 This slide for us really sums up what Carriage 5 Hill is going to be about in terms of people, the 6 sense of place, the architecture for the senior 7 housing. There are over 6,400 residents, age 62 to 8 85, with income levels of $35,000 and greater living 9 in the primary market area. For the carriage homes, 10 there are over 3,600 residents, age 45 to 60, within 11 the targeted income levels that are living in the 12 primary market area. 13 As you know, we've been out meeting with groups 14 over the past year or so. We currently have over 15 200 people on an interested party list whose ages 16 range from their mid-thirties to their mid-eighties 17 that want to move here and live here. We actually 18 have, in a few instances across the three targeted 19 generations, families that are interested in each 20 product type where we could have a grandparent, a 21 parent and an adult child live in this community, 22 and that's what it's all about. 23 It will be a unique project with a variety of 24 housing types that will fill a need in the town 21 1 across several generations. The mixed housing 2 product, senior carriage and estate home, meets 3 and exemplifies the Comprehensive Plan guidelines. 4 The planning techniques for PDD zoning, cluster 5 housing design, open space preservation, the 6 preservation of historic resources and the three 7 archeological sites, the creation of recreational 8 areas and the community garden slots and quad and 9 the walking trails as well as the conservation zone, 10 the broadening of the tax base for the town and the 11 extension of public infrastructure all are in 12 concert with the Comprehensive Plan guidelines. 13 As I stated earlier, the property encompasses 14 two school districts: The Brittonkill School 15 District and the Averill Park Central School 16 District. Our professionals used local and state 17 data and guidelines to forecast population 18 projections and school-age children by housing type. 19 The result of that is that the project will create 20 72 children. 21 When we designed the housing, it was very 22 important to us. I met with both Superintendent 23 Dr. Snyder and Superintendent Dr. Johnson and we 24 purposely orientated the senior housing within the 22 1 Brittonkill School District. As you can see, we've 2 shaded that in and only one estate quad is in the 3 Brittonkill School District and a portion of the 4 senior housing. This project will virtually have no 5 impact on the Brittonkill School District. 6 According to Dr. Johnson and a 2003 study done 7 by the Capital District Regional Planning 8 Commission, the Averill Park School District over 9 the last several years has had stable to declining 10 enrollments. The future of projections from Dr. 11 Johnson in that study forecast those enrollments to 12 remain stable or decline due to a decline in live 13 births and larger graduating classes being replaced 14 by smaller elementary classes. 15 The project can accommodate the forecasted 16 number of 72 children in the Averill Park School 17 District. 18 MR. URSBRUNG: My name is Greg Ursbrung. I'm a 19 professional engineer and principal with the 20 Saratoga Associates. 21 I'd just like to go over the sort of details of 22 the subdivision and site plan on the project. We 23 worked very hard with United Development to develop 24 a design that would be consistent with the Town's 23 1 Comprehensive Plan and as Michael went over earlier, 2 this included cluster residential development. 3 I just might add that in laying out the cluster 4 development, we tried to keep those at the lower 5 elevations so they would be naturally screened by 6 the surrounding hills and then the less dense 7 development would be at the higher elevations which 8 is where the estate homes are. 9 And, also, Michael had gone over previously the 10 preservation of open space where we're preserving 75 11 acres, conservation and recreation of the trails and 12 so forth and then provision of the senior citizen 13 housing. The roads will be designed in accordance 14 with Town standards and conveyed to the Town at the 15 completion of construction for ownership and 16 maintenance. And that is pretty much all of the 17 site roads with the exception of the senior housing 18 site will be owned and maintained by a Homeowner's 19 Association. 20 We have entrances onto New York State Route 2 21 and Pinewoods Avenue. We've contacted both the New 22 York State Department of Transportation and the 23 County Highway Department and obtained preliminary 24 approval for these entrances. The roads themselves 24 1 will be designed with street trees and 2 streetlighting. Lighting will be down lighting with 3 cutoffs to minimize light impacts. 4 And, also, as Andy had mentioned earlier, there 5 are some linear wetlands located throughout the site 6 and we really worked very hard to provide a road 7 alignment that would minimize any impacts to those 8 wetlands. 9 We've been also working with the Army Corps of 10 Engineers and we'll be filing a pre-construction 11 notice with them prior to the start of construction 12 for their review and approval. 13 The stormwater management for the project site 14 will be done in accordance with New York State DEC 15 and EPA Phase 2 standards. With that, we will be 16 providing storm detention to limit runoff from the 17 project site to pre-development grades. We'll also 18 be providing water quality treatment of stormwater. 19 These will be provided in detention and water 20 quality basins located throughout the site. 21 As an additional precaution, we'll also be 22 providing a 25-foot protective buffer along the 23 Class C stream, which is located in the southern 24 portion of the site. 25 1 With regard to the water supply, we estimate 2 about 55,600 gallons per day average daily demand 3 for the project. We've performed flow tests out on 4 a 16-inch main located along Pinewoods Avenue which 5 will provide water to the project and found that 6 there is sufficient capacity for both domestic and 7 fire-fighting needs. 8 We've also coordinated with the Eagle Mills 9 Fire Department with regard to fire access to the 10 site and location of fire hydrants. 11 This project will require the creation of Water 12 District 13. Currently, it is Water District 3 13 which extends 500 feet from the center line of 14 Pinewoods Avenue. Water District 13 will 15 essentially extend to the boundaries of the project 16 site. So the entire project is included in that 17 district. 18 On-site sanitary sewer will be comprised of a 19 combination of gravity and pressure sewers. There 20 will be five lift stations located on the project 21 that will direct waste water to a force main 22 located along Pinewoods Avenue. 23 And, again, this will require creation of Sewer 24 District 7, which will extend to the boundaries of 26 1 the project site. 2 Now, from the project site, waste water will be 3 pumped in a force main along the northern side of 4 Pinewoods Avenue along this direction here to a 5 manhole located at the intersection of Maple Avenue. 6 We've contacted both the city and the county and 7 determined that there is adequate capacity both in 8 the city sewers and in the waste water treatment 9 plant to accommodate flow from the project. 10 During the course of the -- 11 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: I'm sorry. It's 12 virtually impossible to hear what you're saying out 13 here. Something's obviously wrong from the previous 14 speaker. Anything we can do with the technology? 15 (Pause in the proceedings.) 16 MR. URSBRUNG: The construction of the force 17 main along Pinewoods Avenue will require 18 landscaping and other improvements during 19 construction and these will be replaced in kind to 20 the extent practical. And United will be 21 coordinating with each of the adjacent landowners 22 prior to the start of the construction. 23 With that, I'd like to turn it over to Rick 24 Benas. 27 1 MR. BENAS: My name is Rick Benas. I'm a 2 licensed landscape architect and a principal at 3 Saratoga Associates. You've heard from Michael 4 pretty much about the quality development that's 5 going in. That's the number one factor in visual 6 impact assessment, high quality architecture with a 7 theme behind the development to preserve as much 8 vegetation as possible. That, we believe, is the 9 number one character determinant in Brunswick, which 10 is the delightful vegetation. And in this project, 11 75 acres will be permanently preserved and 89 12 percent of the site will be vegetated. 13 In addition, because of the concern for the 14 preservation of vegetation, this applicant has 15 redesigned this project several times and each time, 16 they relocated elements to preserve vegetation. 17 They downsized this in order to preserve vegetation 18 and they made a commitment for ornamental plantings 19 to reestablish vegetation where grading required its 20 removal. 21 Another big factor is the delightful country 22 club which everybody enjoys and appreciates in 23 Brunswick. And in order to preserve the spatial 24 enclosure that defines the fairways, the applicant 28 1 has put aside sufficient buffer zones so that it 2 will not be housing them. It will be highly 3 vegetative and that you can see with the 10-acre 4 preserve in the lower southern and western portion 5 of the site. 6 Lighting will be done with full cutoff 7 fixtures. You heard that. That's a commitment. 8 And there will be a very delightful sense of 9 entrance landscape architecture conceived, two 10 mapped kind of entranceways, that other subdivisions 11 have done and also in some of the high quality 12 housing. 13 Finally, any design is only as good as the 14 maintenance characteristics and United has agreed, 15 and there will be a maintenance program so that the 16 grounds are well maintained and are taken care of. 17 So that any dying ornamental plantings are replaced 18 and lawns are properly mowed and so forth. 19 With that, I'll turn it over to Wendy for 20 discussion of traffic. 21 There's one other thing, though, before Wendy 22 starts about traffic. One of the other important 23 community determinants is the maintenance of Route 2 24 without geometric changes. And so the traffic plan 29 1 accomplishes that which helps also preserve the 2 character of Brunswick. 3 MS. CIMINO: Good evening. For the record, my 4 name is Wendy Cimino. I'm also a licensed 5 professional engineer in New York State and work 6 with Creighton Manning Engineering. We are the 7 traffic consultants for the project. 8 What I'd like to do is go over in a little bit 9 more detail than some of the other speakers the 10 actual methodologies and analysis that was 11 undertaken as part of the traffic study for this 12 project. 13 First of all, we looked at three existing 14 intersections: The intersections of Route 2 with 15 South Lake Avenue, Route 2 with Pawling Avenue and 16 Pawling Avenue with Pinewoods Avenue. These three 17 intersections were chosen since they will most 18 directly be impacted by the traffic from this 19 project. 20 We also looked at the two-site access 21 intersection and the future conditions. 22 The first step in our analysis is to collect 23 existing traffic volume information. We collected 24 peak hour turning movement counts at the three 30 1 existing intersections. We collected this data in 2 October of 2004 and data is collected both in the 3 morning and afternoon peak period. These represent 4 typically the highest periods of residential traffic 5 and also coincide with commuter peak traffic which 6 is also the highest volume on the adjacent roadway 7 network. 8 Those counts are done for two hours during each 9 of the morning and afternoon periods. That volume 10 is broken down to determine the peak one-hour volume 11 condition and those volumes become the basis for our 12 traffic study. We then forecast the volumes to a 13 future year which represents the expected year of 14 full buildout of the development. For this project, 15 it was a five-year buildout that was estimated. 16 What we do is we take a background growth rate 17 that's an approved rate based on New York State DOT 18 historical traffic volume information and basically 19 just take all the numbers and increase them by this 20 rate annually for a five-year period. This will 21 then -- 22 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Pardon me. Could you 23 outline the outline of the project as opposed to 24 what's around it? I'm a little confused. 31 1 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: I'd like to have her 2 finish her presentation. At that point, we can open 3 it up for questions. 4 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Well, it's nice to know 5 what we're talking about as she shows this. 6 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Carry on with the 7 presentation, please. 8 MS. CIMINO: Sure. This is the project site. 9 The purple circles are the intersections that I am 10 referring to in my study. Basically -- 11 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Could you outline the 12 project again? 13 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: This is going to be a 14 long night. You gotta bear with us here. There's a 15 lot of people. We'd just like to get through the 16 presentation. At that point, if you'd like to come 17 up and ask specific -- 18 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: We can't hear back here. 19 You got all these people here and nobody can hear 20 back here. 21 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: I'm concerned to know -- 22 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: How can we comment on 23 something if we can't hear? 24 MS. CIMINO: I can try to speak up a little 32 1 bit. I hear people saying they can't hear. 2 These forecasted volumes is what we call our 3 noble condition and these volumes are increased over 4 the existing -- and represent the conditions on the 5 road that would be there regardless of this 6 development as traffic would just increase due to, 7 you know, additional cars and population growth. 8 The Institute of Transportation Engineers, 9 referred to as ITE, has a trip generation manual 10 which is a manual that has rates to estimate the 11 amount of traffic that would be generated by a 12 development. This is the industry standard for 13 developing trip rates for a project. We used a 14 single-family home and also senior housing land use 15 code. And based on those calculations as estimated, 16 the project would generate approximately a hundred 17 trips during the morning peak period and 135 trips 18 during the afternoon peak period. 19 Just as a note, senior housing is actually a 20 very low traffic generator since a lot of people 21 that live in this facility don't have to come out of 22 their homes during the typical commuter period. 23 They're retired. Therefore, in comparison, if this 24 was a typical apartment project not limited by age, 33 1 there would be much more traffic generated by this 2 site. 3 We then take those trip generations. We then 4 distribute this traffic onto the roadway network 5 based on observed travel patterns and also the 6 estimate of traffic from the development and where 7 the people will be coming to and from. The highest 8 percentage of traffic will be traveling through the 9 Route 2/Pawling Avenue intersection. Approximately 10 60 percent is estimated to travel to and from the 11 site through the City of Troy. 12 It's estimated that very few of the trips will 13 come to and from east of the site. We then take 14 those distributed trip generation numbers, add them 15 to our no build volume and develop our build volume 16 conditions. We then conduct an analysis of these 17 intersections using the highest capacity software 18 which, again, is industry standard for analyzing 19 intersections. This is a rating system based on 20 average vehicle delays and range from an A to F and 21 is similar to a report card system where A is your 22 best operation and F would be your worst operation. 23 Based on the results of our study, the two 24 signalized intersections on Pawling Avenue, with 34 1 minor modifications to the existing signal systems, 2 these intersections will operate consistent with the 3 existing conditions. And based on our analysis, 4 regardless of the existed development, those signal 5 timing improvements will probably be needed in the 6 future regardless of this development. 7 It's also noted there are some improvements 8 being contemplated by the City at the Route 9 2/Pawling Avenue intersection. And we also ran our 10 analysis assuming that those improvements were done 11 as well and those improvements would also 12 work -- there would be no additional improvements 13 needed with this project. 14 At the unsignalized intersections, including 15 the two site driveway intersections, will operate at 16 good levels of service. And no, as we stated 17 before, geometric improvements are needed at any of 18 the intersections. 19 The last analysis we do is a site distance 20 evaluation at the two proposed site access points. 21 That's a measure of the visibility for a driver 22 leaving the site looking left and right to be able 23 to have enough visibility to enter the roadway 24 system and also for turning left into the site, the 35 1 visibility looking straight on the major highway. 2 The measured site distances are compared to the 3 American Association of State Highway & 4 Transportation Officials, commonly known as AASHTO, 5 their criteria for the site distance. And for both 6 the site driveways, for all the movements, we also 7 meet that criteria as well. 8 So overall, as I said, there's minor signal 9 timing improvements and there's no geometric 10 improvements and the site access roads will operate 11 with single lane approaches. We're recommending 12 stop signs be placed on the exiting approaches. 13 I will turn it back over to Mike. 14 MR. UCCELLINI: Thank you, Wendy. The 15 Comprehensive Plan calls for developments to provide 16 positive economic impacts to the Town and broaden 17 the Town's tax base. We have forecasted that 18 approximately a million-four in sales tax revenue 19 will be generated during construction; that 20 approximately $200,000 per year in sales tax revenue 21 will be generated at project completion. 22 There will be over a million dollars in real 23 estate taxes annually paid within the Town as a 24 result of the project. The project is going to pay 36 1 to the Town's Park & Rec Fee Fund a $155,000 2 payment. And in addition, the project will create 3 60-plus temporary new jobs as well as 10 permanent 4 new jobs in the Town. 5 Orchard Village is the middle income senior 6 housing component for the project. I talked about 7 earlier that there is no middle income senior 8 housing in the Town. The development of Orchard 9 Village will allow the moderate income seniors in 10 the Town to remain as lifelong residents and enjoy a 11 quality of life that centers around socialization, 12 intellectual stimulation and recreational 13 activities. 14 The smaller residential-styled apartment 15 buildings have been placed between the community 16 clubhouse and eight villa-styled buildings and help 17 create a sense of place, a village green and a 18 beautifully landscaped community. 19 The apartments will have a New England style of 20 architecture that is in keeping with the rural 21 character of the Town, as you can see, and it's 22 depicted in these renderings. You have the village 23 green looking at the community clubhouse which 24 creates a naturalistic landscaped setting with 37 1 places for gathering, conversation and activities. 2 There will be distinctive floor plans with 3 kitchen windows, balconies and solariums. One- to 4 two-bedroom apartment plans will range in size from 5 650 to 1,500 square feet. The design of these 6 apartments is such that it will promote independence 7 through the normal transitions of aging, yet, allow 8 for adaptations to changes in the residents' daily 9 living activities. 10 There will be maintenance-free living. There 11 will be full-time professional property management 12 and maintenance staff with a 24-hour emergency 13 response system. There will be secured entrances 14 into each apartment building with intercom and video 15 access. And there will be a nurse call system in 16 each apartment home as well as comprehensive fire 17 safety detection systems with full smoke alarms and 18 a sprinkler system. 19 The hub of the community will be the community 20 clubhouse, not only for the senior housing but for 21 the carriage homes and the estate homes. This 22 10,000 square foot state-of-the-art clubhouse will 23 have many amenity-filled features, such as an indoor 24 lap pool or aqua aerobics or lap swimming. It will 38 1 have a surround sound media room for theater night. 2 It will have a gray room and cyber cafe with a 3 residential style kitchen to generate places of 4 holiday parties, gatherings, activities. 5 There will also be a state-of-the-art fitness 6 room that will have equipment, not only for seniors 7 but for the baby boomers living in the carriage 8 homes or the Gen X-ers and baby boomers living in 9 the estate homes. In addition, there will be a game 10 room, conference room and library. 11 As part of the community clubhouse, United 12 Group's proprietary SUN program is a program that 13 really facilitates relationships with community 14 service providers and allows the seniors or the 15 residents to remain as independent for as long as 16 possible. It is a seven-prong model that is 17 proprietary to our company. In the eight 18 communities that we manage around the Capital 19 Region, it's alive; it's working; it's a fantastic 20 program. 21 The components are listed up there. I'll read 22 them. There's a health and wellness component, a 23 finance and legal component, education and lifelong 24 learning, convenience and economics, fun and 39 1 recreation, community and friendship and safety and 2 security. 3 Now, I'd just like to give a couple examples of 4 these, because it's very important. The health and 5 wellness component: Currently, we will have grocery 6 delivery. Hannaford and Price Chopper will come to 7 the property with Coach buses, pick the seniors up 8 if they don't want to drive, take them to the 9 grocery store, bring them back. We will have 10 pharmacy delivery. We create a linkage with a 11 pharmacist in the area. We pre-screen home health 12 aids so that if a senior aid is in place, we work 13 with the families. We have a resident service 14 coordinator who has had a master's in social work 15 that will work with the families and assess the 16 residents' needs and provide counseling and act as a 17 liaison with those families and caregivers and the 18 community senior organizations. 19 The education and lifelong learning piece 20 consists of programs and speaker series on estate 21 planning, Medicaid care, financial planning. We 22 literally will have speakers come to the property 23 and present in the clubhouse on various topics. 24 We also create a partnership with a local 40 1 university and wherever our properties are to 2 provide educational programs in history, art or 3 foreign languages if somebody wants to learn a 4 second language. 5 The fun and recreation piece will be run by an 6 activities director who will coordinate cooking 7 classes, wine tastings, intergenerational programs. 8 There will be many volunteer opportunities and trips 9 to SPAC, casinos, Radio City, Pepsi Arena, et 10 cetera. It really is an entire quality of life 11 program. We don't just provide shelter for seniors. 12 We provide a quality of life. 13 I talked earlier at the beginning about the 14 vision. Carriage Hill's an intergenerational 15 community catering to the Eisenhower, Baby Boomers 16 and Gen X-ers. We are serving a community need in 17 the Town. There is a need for middle income senior 18 housing. We are committed to the Comprehensive Plan 19 principles in providing senior housing as called out 20 for in the Comp Plan. We're clustering the 21 development as called out in the Comp Plan; 22 techniques like PDD, sensitive growth. We're 23 preserving 75 acres of land to keep the scenic 24 vistas, the attractive landscaping. 41 1 I think the architectural styles are New 2 England in nature, but they're in keeping with the 3 Town of Brunswick's rural character and the 4 environmental sensitivity with the 10-acre 5 conservation zone, the protection of natural 6 resources, the protection of archeological sites, 7 the buffers provided around the wetlands. And we 8 are expanding the tax base and extending the public 9 infrastructure within the Town, which is all called 10 out for in the Comprehensive Plan. 11 The project advantages -- I went over 12 them -- are community need, the positive economic 13 impacts and the tax base. There is virtually, as I 14 said, no impact on the Brittonkill School District 15 and we are serving the need of the local seniors. 16 And with that, I'd like to turn it back over to 17 the Supervisor for the question and answer period. 18 Thank you very much for listening to us. As I said, 19 I am based in the Town and I'm very passionate about 20 doing the right thing and providing senior housing. 21 Thank you. 22 (Applause.) 23 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Okay. What we've done 24 tonight is we've opened the parking lot next to us, 42 1 the highway garage, for the overflow. We put a 2 walkway in. With my loud voice, you can probably 3 hear me outside, but we put some speakers out there. 4 My concern is I want to make sure everybody who has 5 concerns will be heard. You know, we'll start in 6 here with these people. The people outside, if you 7 have questions, comments, you know, I'm going to ask 8 you to come in and use the microphone. We can stay 9 til 2:30 or so, but I want to make sure everybody 10 has a chance at the mike and has their comments. 11 The other thing I want to announce is from now 12 on, going forward, we're going to coordinate with 13 Tamarac High School and have the public hearings in 14 Tamarac's auditorium. 15 (Applause.) 16 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: They have a seating 17 capacity of 800 people there. 18 So at this point, we will open the mike and 19 we're going to ask you to come up and speak in the 20 microphone. As mentioned, it goes directly into the 21 tape and helps our Town Clerk recording the minutes. 22 So anybody that wants to get started, the mike 23 is open. We need your name and address, please, 24 also. 43 1 MR. WELCH: My name is Matt Welch. I live at 2 152 Brunswick Road. I'm a property owner. I've 3 lived in the Town for my entire life and I've lived 4 on Route 2, Brunswick Road for my entire life also. 5 I'm opposed to this project. I feel it would 6 change the character of the Town too much in the 7 wrong direction. The project is too big and would 8 have a negative impact on Route 2, Brunswick Road. 9 Route 2 is labeled a scenic highway, to my 10 understanding. The road is busy and getting busier 11 each year. The added traffic would not help the 12 community. 13 I've heard in the past from the town officials 14 that they would like to keep Route 2 rural and let 15 Route 7 develop. I support that idea. I'm not 16 opposed to houses being developed on Route 2 but not 17 at this rate. 18 I understand the seniors of this community 19 deserve adequate housing. Maybe two-story 20 apartments without the 100-plus homes would be more 21 favorable at this location. 22 My job entails traveling around the Capital 23 District and when I talk to people who live in 24 Pittstown, Hoosick, Bennington and parts of 44 1 Brunswick, they tell me how they avoid Route 7 and 2 now travel Route 2. So there's no doubt that Route 3 2 is increasing in traffic from what I see and hear. 4 I'm afraid to even ride a bicycle on Route 2 5 anymore. 6 I also do not see how this project would 7 benefit the residents of this Town as a whole. The 8 current taxpayers of the Eagle Mills Fire District 9 would have to purchase a ladder truck and fire 10 station to house the truck to meet the ISO standards 11 for the nine three-story-high senior apartments. 12 Bottom line: I don't want Brunswick to turn 13 into a Clifton Park. Thank you. 14 (Applause.) 15 MR. RINEHART: Good evening. My name is Bill 16 Rinehart. I'm from Averill Park. I'm on the 17 Averill Park School Board, so we're a little 18 concerned about 105 houses being stuck in our 19 district at 73 kids by their study and 1.5 per house 20 by ours. 21 We have found that $1,700 will be added to the 22 tax rolls for every pupil that we absorb. We're 23 concerned about George Washington. As you all know, 24 it's a smaller-age school. Adding even 72 to that 45 1 load, as we're already approaching capacity, that 2 becomes an issue. 3 I was wondering if they studied how many kids 4 are generated by the empty homes the seniors would 5 be leaving to go to the apartments, because all 6 those empty homes are going to wind up selling to 7 people coming up. 8 And another concern is transportation, 9 bus access, egress. We're figuring at a hundred or 10 120 students, that's three bus loads going through 11 the area twice daily. 12 And just for informational purposes, Averill 13 Park is growing. We are presently at 3,550. The 14 paperwork I saw had us at 3,250. We added 200 when 15 we went to full-day kindergarten the first summer 16 and we are growing. So, of course, that is a 17 concern. Thank you. 18 (Applause.) 19 MS. HAYNES: My name is Susan Haynes. I live 20 at 11 Westlane Road. I think that this Town is 21 running the risk of becoming -- I don't know if 22 you're familiar with the nursery rhyme "The House 23 That Jack Built." I think that because it's being 24 talked about, just adding on and adding on without 46 1 looking at the cumulative impact, we're in danger of 2 becoming the Town that Jack built. 3 Because every time we get a new development 4 proposal, we need to look at how they're all going 5 to tie together. I really think that we need some 6 kind of town planner to look at how all these things 7 are going to relate to each other. And if we keep 8 building like this, we're going without regard to 9 our total future. 10 We need to consider traffic, taxes, impact on 11 schools. And if people are going to want to, say, 12 go to Hoosick Road to do shopping, say, at Walmart 13 or other stores on Hoosick Road, well, people are 14 not going to necessarily all go up South Lake Avenue 15 like good boys and girls. They're going to look for 16 shortcuts. 17 I know in talking to people when I was out 18 talking to people earlier this fall, I met a number 19 of people who said, you know, "People are cutting 20 through our neighborhoods. They're going really 21 fast. Can't you do something?" 22 I met someone who was at the corner of Prout 23 and Thomas and she is elderly and she had a little 24 time on her hands. So on a Tuesday afternoon, from 47 1 2:00 to 3:00, she counted 218 cars cutting through 2 her neighborhood. 3 And I think without considering these 4 cumulative impacts and looking at the whole, we're 5 like the blind man looking at the elephant. 6 (Applause.) 7 MR. TKACIK: My name is Jim Tkacik. I live at 8 387 Brunswick Road next to Welch's Farm. 9 MR. MALONE: Will you spell your last name for 10 the clerk? 11 MR. TKACIK: T-K-A-C-I-K. 12 On the nice slide show that we have here, there 13 was something about the attentiveness to detail. 14 Well, I looked at the DEIS and I see nothing but 15 discrepancies and inconsistencies in the detail. 16 All right? And I'd like to know whether the Town 17 planning people or the Board has given any critical 18 inspection to the details. All right? 19 Let me give one example or examples relating to 20 one matter and that is traffic, all right? Within 21 the DEIS, the traffic engineer -- you -- the 22 assumption for growth of the traffic was what? 23 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: That's all right. 24 MR. TKACIK: One percent a year, right? One 48 1 percent a year. That was the assumption for traffic 2 growth. I don't think that's a valid assumption. I 3 live on Route 2. Since Route 7's been worked on, 4 the traffic there has gone up by how much? It's 5 gone up a lot. A lot of trucks. 6 And there are two traffic reports within the 7 bulk of material at the library. I don't know if 8 anyone's been there. These things, you can get fit. 9 You don't have to go to aerobics or anything. 10 They're just massive volumes. They're loaded with 11 details, but you have to look at the details. 12 In the first bit, in 2002, the peak vehicle 13 traffic, all right, going west, in other words, in 14 the morning going toward Troy, was put at 352 15 vehicles per hour. Okay? 16 Also in there, in another section, they quoted 17 2004, an amount of 470 vehicles per hour. So 18 between 2002 and 2004, the traffic increased by 35 19 percent. Right? 20 And, also, going east, it's actually an even 21 greater amount. In 2002, it was 327 peak vehicles 22 per hour. In 2004, it's 510. That's a 55 percent 23 increase. 24 Now, I don't understand it. Either the 49 1 projection growths are wrong -- in other words, 2 you're saying one percent and there's nothing like 3 that; it's much greater than that -- or the numbers 4 are wrong, in which case they should be ripped up 5 and thrown away. Now, which is it? They can't be 6 both. I think there's problems with the numbers. 7 Another one -- can I have your picture from 8 back there? Could I see that, please? There's one 9 other thing. I didn't spend hours and hours looking 10 at this. I went to the library and looked at this 11 for an hour. I can probably talk all night about 12 this. All right? 13 We're going to talk about details. We'll talk 14 about details. 15 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: I want to make sure 16 everybody has a chance tonight. 17 MR. TKACIK: If you're not going to review with 18 a critical eye to detail in those rates of material, 19 there's no use printing them. 20 In what I would call the line of sight, the 21 sight distance for automobiles coming on Route 2, 22 which is up here, they site that at approximately 23 1,000 feet coming from Eagle Mills. I can guarantee 24 you if you're a thousand feet away from that spot in 50 1 Eagle Mills, you can't see that spot, because it 2 comes around that curve and it takes a dip. 3 Now, if you look at this map, a thousand feet 4 is -- oh, that's about that far. There's 400. 5 There's 800. A thousand feet is about right here. 6 And anybody who travels that road knows that you 7 can't see that spot, because you're going down in 8 that dip. You're making a curve. And that is 9 absolute nonsense. They're looking at this map and 10 they're saying, "Okay. We can see this far, because 11 there's no bend here." That's not true if you look 12 with your eyes and you can remember your memory and 13 not look at these rings of volumes and these 14 projections and the like, that's it. That's the 15 truth. 16 (Applause.) 17 MR. TKACIK: Now, there's one other thing. I 18 hate to pick on the traffic engineer here. We're 19 talking about the intersection of Route 2 and 20 Pawling down in Troy. All right? What is the -- 21 I'm not a traffic engineer. What's the level of 22 service of that intersection in rush hour? 23 MS. CIMINO: Right now? 24 MR. TKACIK: At rush hour. 51 1 Does anybody on the Board know? 2 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Should know. 3 MR. TKACIK: That's right, should know. It's E 4 or F. A is good. E is flunking. F is 5 dysfunctional. 6 We're talking about signal timing improvement. 7 What does the State plan to make that a functional 8 intersection? What would that include? 9 MS. CIMINO: The State's not doing that 10 intersection. 11 MR. TKACIK: I know, but you mentioned -- I'm 12 saying this because you're the one who -- you 13 presented the information. 14 MS. CIMINO: Do you want me to -- I mean, what 15 do you want me to -- 16 MR. TKACIK: My point here is they're glossing 17 over the difficulty. 18 One final thing. What they need to do at that 19 intersection -- it's in the report. It's in the 20 DEIS. So it's relevant to this. This is not just 21 somebody ranting about the traffic -- they have to 22 conduct their roundabout and put a roundabout in 23 there to make that a functioning intersection. 24 And you consider any more traffic volume from 52 1 this project or any other projects, these have to be 2 taken into account. The presentations made here 3 don't mention any of these difficulties. They're 4 glossed over. Get into the details. Go through the 5 reports. You're going to see a lot of 6 discrepancies. You're going to see a lot of 7 inconsistencies where you can say, "Well, some 8 engineer said this and someone else must be right." 9 No, it's not. Just look with your own eyes. Thank 10 you very much. 11 (Applause.) 12 MR. UCCELLINI: It's important that everything 13 gets recorded. So to ask us questions up here and 14 then we're not at a microphone, we can't react. But 15 if it's all right, Wendy would like to address that, 16 because there are some discrepancies in his report. 17 MS. CIMINO: Just a couple of things. 18 Regarding the growth rate, the rate is developed 19 based on a review of New York State DOT data and 20 information that is published. And in addition to 21 that, which I didn't -- you know, I wanted to try to 22 limit my presentation, but we do actually add in 23 other development traffic into that background 24 growth rate as well. 53 1 And we did add some traffic associated with 2 another development that had not yet even been 3 approved, but since we were aware of it and at the 4 time of our study, it was actively in the process 5 with the Town as well, and that rate was actually 6 looked at by New York State DOT and approved by New 7 York State DOT as part of our analysis. 8 The other thing as far as the sight distance 9 that he was pointing to, he actually was not 10 pointing to the correct movement. What that sight 11 line on Route 2 is is when you are actually sitting 12 at the site driveway and you're looking ahead of 13 yourself to see ahead of you the cars coming in the 14 opposite direction to take a left into the site. 15 That -- 16 MR. TKACIK: It doesn't say that. No, that's 17 not what it says there. It says entering the road 18 from the development. 19 MS. CIMINO: There are two different things 20 that we look at. 21 MR. TKACIK: They're the same. Look at your 22 own report. 23 MS. CIMINO: I understand my own report, 24 believe me. There are two -- three measurements. 54 1 Sight distance, one of them, is on Route 2 looking 2 straight ahead when you're sitting at the driveway, 3 take a left into the site. That measurement is in 4 there. The other two is when you're sitting back on 5 the site access and you look to the left and you 6 look to the right. And those measurements were 7 made -- we went out in the field and we walked that 8 measurement. We look at that measurement. 9 We don't just look at a plan on a piece of 10 paper. We're out there and we measured them several 11 times. And they're based on standards. They're 12 based on criteria. They're based on a certain level 13 that you look at for, you know, your height of eye 14 and your height of driver. 15 So when you go out there and you're looking, 16 you may not be looking at the same standard and, you 17 know, we're actually simulating looking if you're 18 sitting in a vehicle and, you know, it's very 19 distinct criteria and it's based on, you know, the 20 actual criteria like I had mentioned before. 21 The level of service at the Route 2/Pawling 22 Avenue intersection, our analysis shows currently it 23 is not a failing intersection during the peak 24 periods. There is one movement that is actually at 55 1 a lower level of service. The City is looking at 2 improvements at that intersection. A roundabout 3 will actually -- that intersection will operate at 4 level B or A during peak periods. A roundabout can 5 handle an extensive amount of traffic. 6 One of things at that intersection is the 7 movement right now, a lot of left-turn movements. 8 When you put a roundabout intersection, you 9 eliminate all left-turn movements from an 10 intersection. Therefore, you can handle a lot more 11 traffic. 12 Our analysis shows if those improvements are 13 not done, because they are not set in stone by the 14 City, that the signal improvements that we're 15 recommending will result in levels of service that 16 are acceptable at that intersection. 17 The reason for those timing improvements is 18 that signal system as well as the one to the south 19 are an older system that is pre-timed; meaning, the 20 signal timings do not change during your peak hours 21 to fluctuate and adjust to the set flow of traffic. 22 The more advanced and modern signals have the 23 detectors in the roadway so that your signals 24 operate much more efficiently on their own. It can 56 1 sense the vehicles there. It can lengthen the green 2 time, shorten the green time. It does what it needs 3 to do to get that flow of traffic through there. 4 Those signals are pre-timed. They do not do 5 that and they could probably if you did some of 6 those improvements we're recommending now. It would 7 actually operate better. 8 And so that's my response. I don't know if 9 that helps. I don't want it to be, you know, 10 misconstrued that some of things that were said were 11 not the right movements. We did go out in the 12 field. We're there more times than we usually want 13 to be out there measuring and looking and counting. 14 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: What will happen is all 15 these comments that are brought up, as mentioned, 16 will have to be responded to in writing. 17 One thing I've noticed living on Tamarac Road 18 the last two years, three years, from 7:00 to 7:30 19 in the morning, I mean, it's unbelievable amounts of 20 traffic. I don't know where it comes from. There 21 is a lot of Vermont plates. I'm guessing Hoosick 22 Falls -- 23 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: They're bypassing Route 24 7. 57 1 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Wait a minute. What 2 I'm telling you is they're all going down to Route 3 12 and I understand that. And, you know, I just 4 don't want you to blame the growth of Brunswick on 5 that, because we haven't had very much growth in 6 Brunswick, you know, which this original project, 7 let me tell you, was approved -- just bear with me. 8 I don't want to give numbers, but this original plan 9 was approved. I voted against it. Okay? You 10 people are there thinking we got our minds made up. 11 That's not true. I voted against it and Michael 12 will tell you and his father. You gotta go through 13 these steps. I mean, this is a different project 14 than it was before. 15 But what I'm telling you, what people blamed 16 Route 7 crazy traffic, you know, it's Route 7, I 17 mean, they're going through. They're building in 18 Vermont. They're skiing. I don't know what they're 19 doing. They're coming down Tamarac Road. They're 20 going down Route 2. If I could stop it 100 percent, 21 the darn traffic keeps coming. So there is 22 concerns. I understand you don't want to add more 23 to it, but what I'm telling you is the whole area is 24 changing and we are feeling some of that. 58 1 MR. DURKIN: Joseph Durkin, Eagle Mills. You 2 might have heard us talk at some of the prior public 3 hearings for Hudson Hills and the Highland Creek 4 about cumulative impact; it was mentioned 5 previously, and the obligation of the Board to 6 engage in comprehensive planning. And that all 7 doesn't need to be said, although probably should be 8 said again, but we won't take up the time with that. 9 I live on Pinewoods Avenue, corner of Pinewoods 10 and Maple. And Pinewoods Avenue is a perfect 11 example of the problems that we're faced with by the 12 cumulative impact of these projects and the need for 13 comprehensive planning. 14 Pinewoods Avenue will become a very busy road. 15 It's a very vulnerable road to traffic right now. 16 It will become a major route from south traffic. 17 Now, you said before there's the five planned 18 development districts currently before you and 19 there's other growth in town as well, but picture 20 Pinewoods Avenue with a Walmart over on Route 7. 21 Does anyone else live on Pinewoods Avenue? 22 (Affirmative responses.) 23 MR. DURKIN: And people are not going to just 24 come from Brunswick to go to Walmart. Picture a 59 1 couple developments east of Eagle Mills on Pinewoods 2 Avenue, east of us, and people going to and from 3 Albany, going to work. I take Pinewoods Avenue to 4 go to work. I think Pinewoods Avenue will become a 5 major thoroughfare for traffic from the south for 6 the Walmart, for these developments. 7 Now, I'm not picking on this particular 8 development. There are other problems with this 9 development, but let's just focus on the traffic 10 generated by all of these projects that you're 11 currently considering. They're all going to go by 12 my house. I don't know whose other houses they're 13 going to go by, but they're going to be by my house. 14 When I first moved into Brunswick 11 years ago, 15 a very, very large John Deere tractor went up 16 Pinewoods. It was Mr. Herrington's tractor. I 17 gotta tell you I was thrilled. I said this is the 18 greatest thing in the world. I live in the country. 19 That's the kind of traffic I like. It was 20 wonderful, by the way, this past fall when you were 21 putting the manure on the field. That's the price 22 of living where I live. That doesn't bother me. 23 It's this other traffic that we're concerned about. 24 Anyway, you know, I think you have to really 60 1 take into consideration all of what's going on, the 2 other projects that you're considering. I know 3 you're tired from hearing us say it, but we have to 4 keep repeating it. You have to take it into 5 consideration. 6 Now, there's other problems with Pinewoods 7 Avenue. Now, this particular project is going to 8 bring the sewer up from Troy. Now, there's a 9 concept in SEQRA called growth-inducing impact. 10 That's a big growth-inducing impact right there. 11 You bring that sewer out to this project and every 12 single open space along Pinewoods Avenue is now fair 13 game for development. Now, that's good or bad, you 14 know, but that's something you have to take a look 15 at. 16 Now, with the traffic that's elsewhere in 17 Brunswick, south of Brunswick and Albany, plus 18 perhaps, some other large developments going in on 19 the open space, Brunswick Avenue is going to become 20 a very, very crowded street and this is another 21 problem with these planned development districts. 22 They're little zoning ordinances unto themselves. 23 Once you start simply granting planned 24 development districts as the developers propose 61 1 them, how can you ever say no to another planned 2 development district? When do we reach enough 3 planned development districts in a particular 4 location? 5 Pinewoods Avenue, once you put the sewer in, is 6 Mr. Miller going to turn his back on several hundred 7 quarter-acre lots or eighth-acre lots like over in 8 Highland Creek? Maybe not. I don't know. Welch's 9 farm is currently zoned 15,000 square feet. Maybe 10 that gets sold. Maybe that gets developed. Before 11 you know it, Pinewoods Avenue is going to look like 12 Latham. And, once again, when I first moved down 13 here, I was thrilled with the way it looked. I 14 don't want to live in Latham. That's something you 15 have to take into consideration. 16 Now, one thing I have to mention: The fellow 17 over here mentioned details of the project. I have 18 a sneaking suspicion that what's going on with this 19 particular planned development district is an effort 20 to achieve a density greater than would currently be 21 allowed. I'd like to get a little clarification on 22 what is meant by the recreation zone that is a 23 considerable portion of this project. I think maybe 24 60, 70 acres of this project is currently under 62 1 recreation zone. 2 I ask the Town: What's permitted in that 3 zone? I was told a golf course only. So, 4 currently, about 60 or 70 acres of that area can't 5 be built on if the information I was given is true. 6 I don't know where this other 75 acres of open space 7 is currently located on that map. It's hard to tell 8 where reading the Draft Environmental Impact 9 Statement, but I would like to get some 10 clarification on what the zoning -- what the current 11 zoning would allow. 12 Now, they claim 210 houses. I think it's 13 considerably less when you take into account the 14 limitations from the current zoning ordinance, the 15 inherent limitations in the land. I think achieving 16 a greater density than you currently achieve with 17 the current zoning ordinance and I don't think 18 that's what's meant by cluster development. 19 I think cluster development is take the density 20 that everyone believes is appropriate for the region 21 and then to put it in the middle of the spot or 22 maybe corner and truly devote space to open space. 23 I didn't see a lot of open space on that particular 24 plan. 63 1 And I wasn't going to bore you with the quotes 2 that I gave the last time, but there's one I do want 3 to make. According to the Town Law -- and that's 4 not your law; that's the Town Law of the State of 5 New York -- the most important powers and duties 6 granted by the Legislature to a town government is 7 the authority and responsibility to undertake town 8 comprehensive planning and regulated land use for 9 the purpose of protecting the public health and 10 safety and general welfare of its citizens. 11 Now, I've said previously you have to take into 12 consideration all of us, not just the benefit of the 13 developer, and I know you're taking that into 14 conversation. 15 I also have one thing to add. I do note that 16 the Town's own ordinance calls for a report from the 17 Zoning Board of Appeals. I don't know if that's 18 been generated yet, but I think it would be a 19 wonderful place to have this study of what the 20 development potential of that site currently is as 21 currently zoned. And I'd like to hear the results 22 of that report. Maybe somebody could do an 23 alternate site plan showing what could be built 24 there without the planned development district. And 64 1 that's it for today. 2 (Applause.) 3 MR. BRINGSJORD: Selmer Bringsjord. 18 West 4 Road, Brunswick Hills. I want to first report that 5 I have to confess that I have a very old-fashioned 6 view of procreation. Apparently, I've been 7 enlightened about a number of things tonight and one 8 of those things is someone at odds with how we 9 usually procreate. I discovered that the project 10 will create 72 children and I didn't realize that. 11 I have to also confess I have a really 12 old-fashioned view of transportation, you know, like 13 moving buses of people who are taking trips to 14 Atlantic City on the Mohawk Trail and into Route 2 15 and so forth might not be so pleasing aesthetically, 16 but you know, it's been informative. I've learned 17 something there as well. 18 So let's see. The problem is that the density 19 of this project to any sane human being looking at 20 the Mohawk Trail, which starts in Troy and runs for 21 quite a distance, is preposterous. It is moving us 22 toward having two Route 7's. Why don't we just do 23 that? Why don't we just have a Route 7 Corridor and 24 a Route 2 Corridor? That's what this is going to 65 1 do. It's going to open the flood gates. It's 2 patently obvious. Look at it. Look at the density 3 of it. 4 Then, as mentioned, look at Welch's farm and 5 further out. That's the decision you have to make. 6 You want another Route 7? Go ahead. Build this. 7 That's what you'll get. 8 Building individual homes in a reasonable 9 fashion that matches the tenor of the trail as it 10 currently exists, now, that would be smart. This is 11 stupid. It's objectionable. If you flew an 12 airplane -- in fact, you can do that -- going into 13 Albany along the flight path and you overlay this to 14 what you see when you fly in, again, it's patently 15 obvious. It will stick out like a sore thumb. 16 A 10,000 foot clubhouse with tons of people 17 crammed into essentially multi-family housing. Do 18 we see that now on this road? I don't think so. I 19 could, as many people here, fill up the evening. 20 I'm not going to take you up on your offer of 2:30 21 in the morning, but look; the tax revenue game, I 22 mean, what are we? Idiots? 23 (Applause.) 24 MR. BRINGSJORD: You have to figure the 66 1 expenses and you run the calculation, figure out 2 whether it's a -- and if you look on the web, due 3 diligence, you'll find out that every time almost, 4 the argument is made this is going to bring lots of 5 money into your pockets. Actually, the expenses 6 usually outweigh what you take in. And in your 7 presentation, miraculously absent is any discussion 8 of the overall, call it what you will, profit. It's 9 not there. 10 One final thing. You know, I don't know for 11 sure, but I would hazard a guess that this land was 12 at one point associated with a very special home and 13 I bet you that there are some people who know enough 14 about this town to know what that home or what those 15 homes may be. They may still, in fact, be standing. 16 They don't have deeds. 17 In Brunswick Hills, we can't do anything that's 18 contrary to the deeds that restrict development in 19 that area. I haven't heard anything about that. 20 I'm just very curious. And even if those deeds do 21 exist and there's some way around what they say, 22 just think about what you're doing from a historical 23 perspective. You're taking the land that was 24 associated with homes of great character, the homes 67 1 that stand here now in Brunswick and, again, you are 2 standing on the precipice of converting this 3 incredibly historic beautiful road into Route 7 4 number two. That's what you're doing. 5 (Applause.) 6 MR. MESKOSKEY: Pete Meskoskey, 168 Town Office 7 Road. Board members, both Town and Planning Board, 8 we are back once again in yet another meeting, 9 because we have another merchant who wants to come 10 to our town and sell us his wares. These merchants 11 want us to buy their goods. They will say just 12 about anything to make their merchandise sound 13 appetizing. 14 This is the third review and no different than 15 the others. They come into our town and cite our 16 master plan and tell us residents how well their 17 plan to develop this fits into our town. They tell 18 us the project will have very little impact or no 19 impact on the community. They talk about the 20 revenues and the taxes that will be generated. 21 They don't talk about the shortfalls, the 22 impacts on the schools and the shortfalls on the 23 school taxes. They don't talk about the public 24 safety and how dangerous the traffic burden on all 68 1 the roadways have become without any type of new 2 development. 3 I have yet to see one of these merchants agree 4 with one single objection that has been brought 5 forward. These objections have been many by a very 6 diverse group of residents with specific knowledge 7 in the areas of expertise and many others with just 8 a common concern. 9 The merchants, salesmen or developers, 10 whichever fits, have completely ignored the 11 cumulative impact. Isn't it amazing? I can't for 12 the life of me understand how we can have three 13 different reviews of three projects and not one 14 thing in the eyes of the merchants, the developer is 15 wrong. 16 That is because they are motivated strictly by 17 profit. We have one that tells us, for example, the 18 traffic near the project will only be delayed four 19 seconds. Very amusing. Last Thursday, one of the 20 salesmen came to the Town Board meeting and did the 21 old bait and switch. He was very excited, because 22 he reduced the number of apartments from 1,100 to 23 600. He was very pleased with himself and his 24 project. 69 1 This evening, our salesman actually had 2 invitations to ensure he would have people here to 3 speak in favor of his goods. Very slick. The 4 person we have in this evening cited our master plan 5 in his documentation 29 times; in his DEIS, 29 6 times. This merchant told this town and its 7 residents how wonderful this project would be for 8 our town. And 29 times, he assured himself that the 9 project would be good for the residents. And 29 10 times, he gave us opinion, not fact, and molded it 11 to meet his needs, not ours. 12 I could take 29 different people from 29 13 different towns, have them read the master plan and 14 look at this project and come up with 29 different 15 opinions of how this project using the master plan 16 would either benefit or not benefit Brunswick. This 17 is all about the people and the process. 18 It's just amazing to see the participation at 19 this meeting and all the meetings. The people in 20 this room, including all the Board members and all 21 the residents of Brunswick, should be extremely 22 proud of themselves. And the fact that they are 23 involved, this is becoming an historic time in the 24 history of our town. It doesn't matter if you are 70 1 for or against this project or any other project. 2 If you want this project, I wish you well. If 3 you don't want this project, I also wish you well. 4 You have the right and the freedom to express your 5 opinion. This Town Board's job will not be an easy 6 one. They have the responsibility to make informed 7 decisions based on all the facts keeping in mind the 8 cumulative effect all of the projects will have on 9 the people and their families. 10 They must make a decision which meets the needs 11 of everyone. Most importantly, they must be open to 12 all suggestions and opinions. This decision will 13 take time. We must be patient. We, the residents 14 and the families, need to be diligent in letting the 15 Town Board know the facts and how we feel. 16 Remember, knowledge is power. Please make sure 17 these Board members know how you feel and what you 18 want. This is about community, family and a 19 peaceful life. Let the process take place. Thank 20 you. 21 (Applause.) 22 MR. BLANDY: Hi. My name is Tom Blandy. I 23 live at 37 Brunswick Road, which is within sight of 24 the intersection of Route 2 and Pawling Avenue and 71 1 Congress. 2 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: City of Troy, right? 3 MR. BLANDY: The City of Troy, yes. Talking 4 about the big picture, one of the things that I 5 think is very important that Troy and Brunswick have 6 that are very lacking in most cities is that as you 7 leave from Route 2, there is a point at which you 8 leave the suburbs of Troy -- it's in 9 Brunswick -- and you are in the country. And then 10 you keep going a little while and you come to the 11 attractive village of Eagle Mills. 12 This is what's so wonderful about cities in 13 Europe is that they have an edge. This is a 14 boundary jumping project and it is not proper to 15 desecrate the countryside as people have pointed out 16 and I don't want to belabor that. 17 So then this Route 2 intersection that they're 18 going to try to improve, it actually works very well 19 at the moment. And even though there is left-turn 20 planning, there is really no problem. But what 21 they're going to make trucks do with this rotary 22 that they want that I live within sight of is to 23 make trucks make about a 270-degree turn and they're 24 going to eliminate all that vegetation and all that 72 1 nice little island in the middle, which really 2 civilizes the area. It really helps the area a 3 great deal, the immediate vicinity. And they're 4 going to wipe that out for this sprawling but small 5 radius rotary, which means that trucks have to 6 practically go over the center of the rotary, a 7 tractor trailer, to negotiate that turn. And so 8 they wipe out every vegetation in that area. And I 9 object very strongly to that and we're trying to 10 stop that on the Troy side. 11 Now, the other thing I would say to the 12 citizens is you have done -- I'm an architect. I've 13 been to many of these presentations here and 14 elsewhere. And I don't know of any group of people 15 that have made a more sophisticated argument against 16 these projects than I have seen here. 17 What the citizens need to do is keep up the 18 pressure on the Board. 19 (Applause.) 20 MR. BLANDY: The presumption has been -- and 21 these people who -- the developers are expecting 22 this, although I think they're getting a whiff of 23 great shock on the thing; that if they can jump 24 through the hoops, that they have a right to make 73 1 this development, but they don't. It's zoned 2 differently. The Town is against it and the Town 3 must make it clear. 4 And the only thing to do is to make it more 5 painful for the Town Board to do the project than to 6 not do it. And so pressure, pressure, pressure is 7 the answer, in my opinion. Thanks very much. 8 (Applause.) 9 MS. ROBBINS: Good evening. My name is Janet 10 Robbins. I do not live in Brunswick, although I am 11 scouting the area for a property. And when I look 12 for a property -- 13 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Where are you located? 14 MS. ROBBINS: I live in East Greenbush. 15 SUPERVISOR HERRINGTON: Okay. 16 MS. ROBBINS: Rensselaer County. 17 I do believe that this kind of project affects 18 the whole county. We've already heard that it 19 affects the Averill Park School District, so that 20 affects taxpayers in West Sand Lake, Sand Lake and 21 all those areas. So I do believe it is a county 22 problem as well as a Brunswick problem. 23 While I've been listening to the presentation, 24 a couple of weeks ago, I was in a meeting in Colonie 74 1 about a proposed roundabout they're doing on 2 Albany-Shaker Road. And in that presentation, they 3 did have -- the DOT did have listed the roundabout 4 at Route 2 and Pawling. So I believe it is in the 5 cards and will go forward. 6 Today, I was coming up -- oh. Before I move 7 on, I do believe that Mr. Uccellini's group is also 8 involved in a major project down on Congress Street 9 in Troy; whether or not it'll get off the ground, 10 but it is proposed and t